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Author: kalmotis Timestamp:- 27/4/2008 2:27:13 PM Subject: Re: Damien Oliver you are a disgrace
Message: D. Oliver is not a disgrace, however his riding in too many recent races have been disasters. On CP in the doncaster there was very little chance of a run on the inside. If Oliver [ or any other competent jockey ] was just half a horse wider at the 150, it gets out earlier [only needed one or two extra strides ] and wins. This is becaming a tragedy of a once great jockey. And just because the heavens open up everynow and then and the horse knows the way home does not change much. Thats what I think.
Author: Hands N Heels Timestamp:- 27/4/2008 1:10:29 PM Subject: Re: Damien Oliver you are a disgrace
Message: Good call Count, I'd be a little crook if I was on CP but no serious excuses the beaten brigade, not really. I only saw that replay this morning and Bossy rode a fine line between finding the smallest of gaps and causing interference which would no doubt have ended in tears. That's just what the Bossman does, in the big 'uns. Who can forget the navigation on Private Steer in 2004. You need luck in a Donny but Boss somehow always seems to make his own.
Author: Axl_Rose Timestamp:- 27/4/2008 11:22:14 AM Subject: Re: Damien Oliver you are a disgrace
Message: Thanks Gary,
You must be talking about my best roughie post a great part of the credit for that must go to "the other guy" as he repeatedly stressed the importance of always looking for value, would have been interesting if Pinnacles had drawn a good barrier I think he would have won as his normal pattern is to go forward, still it was a great ride by RS Dye, some were saying that he was gun shy after his terrible fall in Hong Kong, after looking at the overhead that truly was a gutsy ride. Glen Boss said yesterday that he doesn't get any good rides in HK I think that if anything has been proven over the last few weeks it is that the level of riding in HK is far superior to that of australia, beadman, boss and dye have proven it with great big race performances over the last month.
Author: Gary Still Timestamp:- 27/4/2008 10:28:41 AM Subject: Re: Damien Oliver you are a disgrace
Message: Axl,
I think you are finally being recognised as having your own identity - and the nature of your recent posts should make it abundantly clear that you are not "the other guy"
Author: Timesman Timestamp:- 27/4/2008 10:27:32 AM Subject: Re: Damien Oliver you are a disgrace
Message: Count,
Great post.
I invested on Casino Prince and my initial reaction was, was there a run to take and Damien didn't take it.
If Axl asked the question its a fair one. Criticising a jockey though is unfair until all the facts are known.
Once Axl asked the question the next logical step is to look at the replay a few times to work out if a run available.
Once this is done and you are speaking in a fully informed manner, you wouldn't be critical of Damien.
From what you have said, other jockey's would have done the same thing that Damien did. ie waited and if a run didn't present scout wide.
Its interesting, that in normal circumstances with the rail being a bit off, Damien would have got the run because the others would have fanned. But, because the track was playing fair, they didn't fan and he didn't get the run.
Finally, given that Triple ran second to WHussler (at its second last start) and Casino Prince was the highest placed horse in the Ryder to run against WHussler (in the Doncaster), how good is Weekend Hussler. Just ask Gary Crispe.
Author: infidel Timestamp:- 27/4/2008 10:05:57 AM Subject: Re: Damien Oliver you are a disgrace
Message: If Oliver was on Triple Honour he would still be waiting for a gap to present itself. He would not have taken the gap Boss did ... and he would not have won.
Author: Axl_Rose Timestamp:- 27/4/2008 9:52:27 AM Subject: Re: Damien Oliver you are a disgrace
Message: LostClarity,
Don't feel that you must make comment on every thread. It would be fair to say that since your recent arrival you have been the most prolific poster on this forum. How about a little quality over quantity?
You talk about me talking through my pocket when it is quite clear from other threads that I was on pinnacles and valedictum. Nowhere did I indicate that I was backing Casino Prince.
Saying that I backed Casino Prince is like Nigel Tufnel claiming that he was on Casino Prince e/w after the race in an effort to grab some sort of moral high ground in one of his numerous attacks on me.
There is simply no evidence to support his or your claims.
If you want to make self serving attacks on the likes of myself, how about you make them on the basis of fact, not fantasy.
Author: CountChivas Timestamp:- 27/4/2008 9:41:25 AM Subject: Re: Damien Oliver you are a disgrace
Message: The only disgrace here is axl_clown
I couldn’t fault Oliver’s ride on Casino Prince, he settled him in the back half of the field with plenty of cover and started to stoke him up as the field approached the home turn. As they straightened for the run home there was a wall of horses in front of Oliver and the wider runners were coming with their runs adding to the traffic jam, Oliver had no choice but to wait and hope for a gap to open up between German Chocolate and Sniper's Bullet who were directly in front of him as Marching had moved up outside Casino Prince to keep him in a pocket, had a gap appeared CP was home and hosed, but it didn’t.
Oliver found himself stuck in that traffic jam until the 200m where Marching felt the pinch and began to drop off opening up the run for Casino Prince, by the time Oliver had put CP through the gap and got him wound up there was only 150m of the Doncaster left to run and Triple Honour had too much lead and momentum to be run down. There’s not much doubt, given TH’s winning margin that had Casino Prince got that run 50m earlier he would have won the race, but there was little that Oliver could have done given the circumstances.
My summary of Oliver’s ride is that it was a great ride that only needed an ounce of luck, an ounce of luck that he would normally get 99% of the time, but an ounce of luck that didn't eventuate in yesterday's Doncaster.
Author: D-Woodsio Timestamp:- 27/4/2008 9:34:13 AM Subject: Re: Damien Oliver you are a disgrace
Message: Prankstar, Oliver had 6 rides yesterday, with 2 winners a 2nd and a 3rd, and considering one of his rides that didnt place - jumped from barrier 17, id say that he is back in form..
Author: lostclarity Timestamp:- 27/4/2008 6:52:58 AM Subject: Re: Damien Oliver you are a disgrace
Message: Axl I might have known ~ I guessed it would be one of you three.
You don't get any better do you, it's a crisis of confidence on and off the track. The family has been decimated and spooked by the Kennedy spectre. So you talk about your pocket.
There was a time when Oliver may have been up there with Beadman. Certainly he was to Melburnians what Beadman was and is in Sydney.
It's more than you deserve but I'll be got in in defence of one of the finest jockeys the country has produced.
Why don't you invent another identity, then you can become four times the fool. You don't get depth by going wide. It's the self-centred content that gives you up. In an instant.
Author: laminate Timestamp:- 26/4/2008 11:17:26 PM Subject: Re: Damien Oliver you are a disgrace
Message: Dont worry about Oliver.. More concerns should be raised over Craig Williams rides... Race 1 he misses the kick by four. He doesn't get Lazer Sharp to settle and it runs accordingly. His ride on Von Costa De Hero was not good.
Author: Rex Timestamp:- 26/4/2008 10:10:34 PM Subject: Re: Damien Oliver you are a disgrace
Message: Axl,
you want to quit while your only a long way behind...........victim of circumstances, it happens mate, learn to live with it or give away the punt (oh, and Oliver is in form). CP as good as WH???....yep, i leave that for others to have fun with.
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